Tide of Damnation

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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby LordLucan » Fri May 27, 2011 6:32 pm

Well plot-wise, I thought Slithiziir could have a role as an infiltrator into the hives. Perhaps he is Rhamah's spy? His armour is for use in battle, but outsid eof it, I picture him flowing through the narrow dank tunnels and alleys of the hive, oozing sinisterly.

I like the idea of the orks being a prominent faction too. Hey, for the early parts perhaps Ghurlag could cover scenes involving the orks? At least while they remain a major presence.
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby King Theasion » Fri May 27, 2011 7:02 pm

That could work very well, I initially invisaged them as a tool of Rhamah's but of course tools can sometimes work against the weilder too. If you're up for it Ghurlag I'm sure we could work it in somehow, it would add a nice element. An there is a plot element that will be kept from you all for a time, simply because myself and Rhamah want to drop it on you later, and see how you and your characters react. There will however, be hints and such. For example we will say that the mass Imperial deployement to these sectors is actually aiding Rhamah's activities, I will leave it to you all to try and find our why. I don't do this simply to be a mean overlord, but I was thinking, if you yourselfs think up theories and such, you could have your characters follow along upon those theories. It may not work of course, but I thought it could be cool to try out.

And I should really get my own Bio up soon :|
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Ghurlag » Fri May 27, 2011 7:09 pm

I'd love to try it, my King, so long as you're sure you want me. Just to be clear: should I be writing a bio for a character I'd use to explore the Orks, or will I just be helping write the orky bits of other people's arcs?

I think I get what you're angling at here - we each have our characters take their own view of the invasion, with the truth hidden in the confusion. Presumably the truth will come up in either you or Rhamah's parts further down the line. It sounds good.

As the misty veil of Albion is cast aside, we turn our gaze to the war-torn island of Albany, where the Red King vies with his former master for the control of a realm in dire threat.
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby King Theasion » Fri May 27, 2011 7:50 pm

I'm not sure, part of it depends on the full list of characters. I however, lean towards the idea of you having a character. A Ordo Xenos Inquisitor perhaps, there will be an Ordo Malleus inquisitor who is an NPC introduced in my opening but there is no reason why two cannot be present. You have more scope to work your magic if you have your own character. I'll run it by Rhamah, see what he thinks.
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Maugan Ra » Fri May 27, 2011 8:11 pm

Gone and added Rhamah on MSN, for varying discussions on corruption of characters and loose planning of the "fall from grace" story arc.

Anyway.... so, you're keeping important plot elements from us, hmm? Can't say I've seen that done in a group story before. Not sure if it will work, but as an experimental technique, I'm happy enough to try it out. Certainly, I know secret knowledge works well in a full RPG, so I guess we'll see.

I'm certainly in favour of the Orks being a serious threat on their own. As I understand it, the Imperium doesn't know about the involvement of Chaos when they start rushing in reinforcements from other sectors (including the Hartokii), which suggests that the Orks are a viable threat in their own right.
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby LordLucan » Fri May 27, 2011 8:14 pm

King Theasion wrote:That could work very well, I initially invisaged them as a tool of Rhamah's but of course tools can sometimes work against the weilder too.


Weirdly, you seem to have a similar idea to myself. I'm envisioning Slithiziir as a conniving figure, who actually secretly resents Chaos Space marines; he despises the fact that Astartes sem to rule over chaos forces, just because they are the biggest and toughest. I can see him trying to gather the dregs of the chaos force unto him discreetly. While he will aid Rhamah overal, ultimately, he's trying to figure out a way to overthrow him.

I love the idea of our character's speculaing upon Rhamah's motives. As a Tzeentchian, Slithiziir will be trying to work out Rhamah's 'angle', as he is well aware that notihng a fellow tzeentchian does is not part of some greater scheme.
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby LordLucan » Fri May 27, 2011 8:15 pm

Maugan Ra wrote:Gone and added Rhamah on MSN, for varying discussions on corruption of characters and loose planning of the "fall from grace" story arc.



Ooh, should I get involved there too? Slithiziir may have a role to play too.
Check out my debut fantasy novel from Fox Spirit Books, The Hobgoblin's Herald (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Hobgoblins-Herald-R-Aston/dp/1910462047). If you've read it, please rate and review it on amazon; I'd be eternally grateful. The sequel, Eater of Names, is out in 2018, so watch this space.
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Maugan Ra » Fri May 27, 2011 8:20 pm

LL - Well, get online then. I'm in the middle of psychology revision as we speak, and frankly discussing Chaos politics sounds far more interesting....

Anyway, I can see where you're coming from with the whole anti-Marine thing. I know for a fact that Lady Winter takes no shit from anybody, mortal or Astartes - enemies in power armour is why they invented Hellguns... and plasma weaponry... and meltas... and tanks... :twisted:
Maugan, your slow descent into madness is starting to look more like a BASE jump...
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby King Theasion » Fri May 27, 2011 8:53 pm

Tanks! TANKS! Ahem, sorry, IG players natural response.

An all the chaos writers are conspiring in secret against me! But I'll show them! Isn't that right sandwich?
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Maugan Ra » Fri May 27, 2011 9:39 pm

Talked a bit with LL, came up with vague possible plan for how the Hartokii fall. Naturally, can be edited depending on situational specifics.

1) The Hartokii, being very proud, find themselves feuding with rival Guard regiments during the early stages of the war. Winter turns a blind eye - after all, her troops are the best, why should they tolerate insults from their lessers?

2) The feuds go beyond petty rivalries and pranks and start escalating into the realm of murders and sabotage - insults are repaid with "accidents" in the field, some Hartokii disable other Guard regimental equipment in an effort to keep them from stealing the glory, etc.

3) The Commissariat steps in, officially lays the blame for the infighting at the door of the Hartokii, met out punishments. Winter feels insulted by the censure and blame, and soon afterwards numerous Commissars meet unfortunate fates as the Hartokii defend their honour.

4) By this stage, the involvement of Chaos is known, and it exacerbates problems. Accusations of treachery and corruption make a perfect excuse to dispose of rival troops out in the field, tensions rise. An Inquisitor goes to assess whether the enemy has a hold in the troops, and gets killed by over-eager Hartokii troops on their own initiative - "The general doesn't need to know."
4.5) Possible alternate, the Inquisitor is killed the the actual enemy, and the Hartokii are actually innocent... but get blamed anyway.

5) Suspicious, high command (KT's Lord General, I'm thinking) orders the Hartokii to be withdrawn from the front until the situation can be resolved. Warden-General Winter, who has just prosecuted a brilliantly successful advance and has no idea about the situation with the Inquisitor, feels mortally insulted and refuses.

6) Warden-General Winters is declared a traitor and a suspected heretic. The order goes out for her arrest and termination - and by extension, that of anyone who supports her. The Hartokii are incensed by what they see as the treachery of their fellows, along with an attack on their beloved leader, and side with their General (those who don't are killed by their comrades as traitors).

7) Guard forces in the region are consumed by the infighting, Chaos takes full advantage. Rhamah makes an entreaty to Lady Winter, most likely via representative. The General, feeling both under-appreciated and horrifically betrayed, agrees to join the invaders against the Imperium that is no longer worthy of her loyalty. Her soldiers, loyal and proud of their commander, follow suit.

8) Rhamah smiles and mutters "Just as planned" :twisted:
Maugan, your slow descent into madness is starting to look more like a BASE jump...
- Rahvin

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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Mossy Toes » Fri May 27, 2011 9:43 pm

Maugan Ra wrote:7) Guard forces in the region are consumed by the infighting, Chaos takes full advantage. Rhamah makes an entreaty to Lady Winter, most likely via representative. The General, feeling both under-appreciated and horrifically betrayed, agrees to join the invaders against the Imperium that is no longer worthy of her loyalty. Her soldiers, loyal and proud of their commander, follow suit.

This will be the hardest part to convey appropriately. Rhamah will, of course, flatter her appropriately...but we need some very convincing rational for her turning...

Also:
most likely via representative.

Well helloooo there Slithiziir! (he could have also helped acerbate the situation--maybe it was him, in the form of a Hartokius, who kills the Inquisitor...)

Edit: sorry, yeah, like Ghurlag I've been watching this, but sidled along too late to join in the fun meaningfully. Still, I'd happily give ideas and council!
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Maugan Ra » Fri May 27, 2011 10:04 pm

Hey there Mossy. And yeah, I agree, step 7 is likely to be the hardest part to convey in a convincing fashion. I'm pretty much going to rely on a few factors in that step, I think:

A) The Hartokii are very proud. This is something that I''ll be attempting to make especially clear through most of the story up until that point. From their perspective, the charges against them are a massive, unforgiveable insult. They are pretty much consumed by vengeance, and would turn against the other regiments even if there wasn't a Chaos lord involved.

B) Chaos agents are definitely exacerbating the situation. Infiltrators like Slith could well be responsible for a lot of the problems, and I'm toying with the idea that they were acting as though the Hartokii were their allies from the start. To the loyal Imperials, the way the heretics are avoiding the Hartokii positions is all kinds of suspicious in and of itself - to the Hartokii, it hides the true nature of their new allies until it is far too late. Might even be traitor forces intervene on behalf of the Hartokii against the units sent to ensure their compliance.

C) The whole thing happens very fast, with a lot of momentum behind it. Rhamah makes his move before Winter can take a metaphorical deep breath and assess the situation. He offers her vengeance and a properly appreciative ally right at the moment that she most desires revenge.

There might also be some sorcery involved, twisting the minds of the Hartokii and artificially enflaming their emotions. Chaos is very insidous, after all....
Maugan, your slow descent into madness is starting to look more like a BASE jump...
- Rahvin

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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Mossy Toes » Fri May 27, 2011 10:07 pm

B) could also help explain why the Hartokii advance is so successful...
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Ghurlag » Fri May 27, 2011 10:11 pm

That's an excellent tie-in, and it shows the kind of insight and use of selective knowledge about the terrain (so to speak) that you'd expect from the followers of Tzeentch. It both flatters the Hartokii's opinion of themselves (because they seem to be doing better, because they're not being targeted by Chaos, and only have to fight the xenos) and immediately sets alarm bells ringing for everyone else.

As the misty veil of Albion is cast aside, we turn our gaze to the war-torn island of Albany, where the Red King vies with his former master for the control of a realm in dire threat.
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Maugan Ra » Fri May 27, 2011 10:16 pm

Ooh, very sneaky. I approve.

Naturally, that won't be so immensely obvious from my parts of the story, but it could certainly be hinted at and implied in other PoV pieces.
Maugan, your slow descent into madness is starting to look more like a BASE jump...
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby King Theasion » Fri May 27, 2011 10:22 pm

These lightning advance could also stop as the feuding starts. My character will be obsessed with correct tactics and protocol and the like, and efficiency in both strategy and battle. Thus, if the advance stops the second the gaurdsman start getting at each others throats, he'd blame Winter's troops for disrupting the smooth running of his plan for their own pride, practically a crime in his book anyway, in which case he probably would have no issues withdrawing Winter from the front and replacing someone who in his eyes 'gets the job done'.

Edit: My Bio is this, it will be added to the main post when we have more Imperial writers.

Lord General Lubeck von Brendine
5th Earl of Redrock
Scourge of Ostvalle
The Imperiums Shield
Lord Commander and Master of the 212th Battle Group

Appearance: Tall, in his mid forties, with close cropped hair and a waxed moustache. Of medium build, kept in shape with often exercise but with a largely unremarkable physique. Dark, heavy set blue eyes.

Equipment: Sabre of Redrock (Usually held on display over his command seat). Bolt Pistol, Armour of the von Brendines (specially manufactuered and heavily ornamented carapace armour, hasn’t been worn for four years, since Lubeck hasn’t seen personal combat for over five)

Bio Lubeck was born a Lord General, that’s what later historians would write. For all its inaccuracies it would fit in their perspective. The second son of the of the Governor Militant of Milanthros, he was given ‘command’ of the Earldom of Redrock at age four. When normal boys attended the Scholarium for the first time, Lubeck had been enrolled in the military academies for a year. When normal boys were learning basic Gothic, Lubeck had already memorised the victories of Solar Macharius, when normal boys were chasing girls and getting drunk, Lubeck was sitting exams on the tactics of the Great Crusade.

Not for the von Brendines, was the drabness of the frontline. Lubeck has never stood in a muddy trench, holding and blood stained lasgun, never bellowed his orders over the roar of an Ork horde or the shrieks of a Tyranid swarm. That is for lesser minds.

No, for Lubeck it was the path of command, from the moment his adolescence settled on his shoulders, he was in the command staff of General Offerstein, and he has never looked back since.

He would argue it is a full, and happy life. Others would argue it less than a life. For he has never taken a wife, some say he has never even felt the touch of a woman’s lips upon his own. No children trace their lineage to him. When his life fades, whether it be old age or the fires of war that claims it, only his military record will stand to remind people he existed.

He is a man submerged in strategy, who some of his men whisper, does not eat or sleep during war time, but subsists off the light off tactical relays and the breath of the Emperor himself. To prosecute a war is an art to Lubeck, and the men and machines under his command, simply tools, to be used up for the preservation of the Emperor’s realm, and the creation of Lubeck’s own masterpiece.

It is not hate, or cruelty that breeds this apathy from Lubeck. It’s simply efficiency. There is no gain from feeling for his men in his grand plans, leave that to lesser officers. He has never had to skulk in an underhive, conscription was not what drove him to the guard, what would he have in common with the private on the frontline anyway?
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby LordLucan » Fri May 27, 2011 11:29 pm

I like the idea of Slithiziir doing a frame job at some point, at Rhamah's behest. I also had the idea that Slithiziir actually loathes astartes, because they remind him of the boorish thugs of his homeworld. He hates that Astartes run most chaos warbands. He perhaps could gather allies from amongst the lowest of the low of the chaos warbands. The real dregs and freaks.

KT: I love your bio. For a man where military strategy is literally all he has, troopers blithely ignoring or threatening his plans would not be tolerated. Excellent source of conflict.
Check out my debut fantasy novel from Fox Spirit Books, The Hobgoblin's Herald (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Hobgoblins-Herald-R-Aston/dp/1910462047). If you've read it, please rate and review it on amazon; I'd be eternally grateful. The sequel, Eater of Names, is out in 2018, so watch this space.
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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Maugan Ra » Sat May 28, 2011 1:11 am

OK, so we're fairly set on the Chaos side of the equation, and we have our bio for the leader of the Imperial side. Stuart still interested in this?

In any case, talking with Rhamah, confirmed that this sector is relatively near to the Cadian Gate (the supplies produced by its hives go to the Gate), which explains why there's a major reinforcement surge when the Orks arrive (are we going with it being Orks as the initial attackers?).

I'm currently trying to decide how many troops General Winter has under her command. Since she's a General fighting in a subsector-wide war, I know it'll be a far chunk of troops (especially given Hartok's military tradition).
Maugan, your slow descent into madness is starting to look more like a BASE jump...
- Rahvin

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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby Maugan Ra » Sat May 28, 2011 2:23 am

OK, back to working on the number of troops Seras Winter commands. I figure Hartok has a larger population than present-day Earth, what with having a military tradition of at least 3 millenia, but some of its forces are going to have to remain behind in the interests of protecting the trade routes that Hartok stands guard over.

Therefore, for my numbers I figured I'd use roughly how many soldiers modern-day Earth can muster. Wikipedia and a calculator tells me that is approximately 88 million. Keep in mind this is cutting out a few countries and rounding down each number to the nearest thousand. Therefore, I'm working on the basis that Warden-General Seras Winter has brought approximately ninety million soldiers with her to fight in the Olynthus subsector.

In terms of organisation, I'm provisionally putting that as:

90 Legions

Each Legion has 20 Divisions of 50,000 men apiece

Each Division has 5 Regiments of 10,000 men apiece

Each Regiment has 10 Battalions of 1,000 men apiece

Each Battalion has 4 Companies of 250 men apiece

Etc etc all the way down the chain to fireteams.

Yeah, this war is going to involve rather a lot of soldiers. This is, after all, just the standing military of a single, not especially overpopulated world. It was, I believe, mentioned that the Olynthus subsector included several Hive worlds....
Maugan, your slow descent into madness is starting to look more like a BASE jump...
- Rahvin

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Re: Tide of Damnation

Postby King Theasion » Sat May 28, 2011 11:33 am

I'm gonna have to detail all the forces for the Imperial expedition aren't I...?
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